Roundtable 5 // Four Techspressionist Artists

Hello! My name is Colin Goldberg, and we are here at the Techspressionist roundtable number 5 today is June 27, th 2025, and the topic of this particular roundtable is for Techspressionist artists. So I have a human moderator here. Michael Pr. Price will be leading us through the conversation, and I also have a special guest to get us started. ChatGPT GPT. So, Hi, chat! Thank you for welcoming us to this conversation.

Hi, everyone! It's great to be here and to help kick off this exciting discussion. I'm really looking forward to hearing about all of your unique perspectives and insights on Techspressionism. So let's dive in and get started.

Okay, great. So ChatGPT the exhibition that's brought us all together is a show that's up right now at 150 mediastream in Chicago. Could you tell us a little bit about what you know about that exhibition?

Absolutely. The exhibition is called for text reference artists, and it's currently being shown at 150 mediastream in Chicago. It features the works of the 4 of you, Colin Goldberg, Renata Janiszewska, Karen LaFleur, and Jan Swinburne. The exhibition is displayed on a stunning 150 foot led wall, creating an immersive digital art experience. It's a fantastic showcase of how technology and art come together. And it's great to see all of you contributing to it.

Thanks so much. And would you mind telling us a little bit about the curator of the exhibition as well.

Of course, the curator of the exhibition is Yuge Zhou. She's a talented video artist herself, based in Chicago, and her work often explores themes of urban life and the immigrant experience she's known for creating immersive video installations, and has been featured in various prestigious venues. Her curatorial eye really brings out the best in Techspressionist art, making this exhibition extra special.

Okay, great. And just quickly. I wanted to find out a little bit about what you know regarding the background of each artist. So I think we'll start with Jan Swinburne. Could you tell us a little bit about what you know about Jan and her work?

Absolutely. Jan Swinburne is a Canadian artist based in Toronto. She works across various media, blending traditional and digital techniques. Jan's art often explores themes like light texture and the relationship between sound and visuals. She's known for transforming audio elements into visual art, creating what she calls waveform landscapes. Her work really captures the intersection of the auditory and the visual, making it truly unique.

Great. And how about Karen LaFleur and her work?

Karen Leflare is a digital artist writer and animator who seamlessly combines traditional drawing and painting with Digital tools to create moving image art. Her work often explores the interplay between inner and outer worlds, focusing on themes of adaptability and resilience. Her animations have been showcased in a variety of prestigious venues, including the Wenwick Gallery of The Smithsonian and the Cape Cod Museum of Fine Arts. Karen's work beautifully blends narrative and visual elements creating a truly engaging Experience.

Thanks so much ChatGPT. And what about Renadia Nashevska's work? Can you tell me a little bit about the artist and her work as well.

Of course, Renata Janiszewska is a Techspressionist artist who creates digital paintings which she often describes as painting on electronic canvases. Her work delves into themes like alchemy, Shamanism, mythology, and feminism. She combines influences from Florentine Renaissance, art, surrealism, and a variety of other artistic traditions, creating a unique fusion of text. Technology and emotion. Granada's work truly stands out for its depth and richness.

Thanks so much, and I know you and I know each other a little bit ChatGPT. But would you mind filling the audience in a little bit about me and my work as well.

Absolutely. Kyan Goldberg, you're known for pioneering the Techspressionism movement which blends technology and personal expression in art. Your work spans various media, including painting, printmaking, and digital art, and you've exhibited in numerous prestigious venues one of your notable pieces and augmented reality. Artwork is permanently installed in the Hearst Tower in New York City. Your art often explores the relationship between the digital and physical worlds, making you a true innovator in the field.

Thank you so much for your kind words, ChatGPT. And lastly, we have a moderator here, Michael Pierre Price, who's also an important part of the Techspressionism community. Would you happen to know anything about Michael and his work as well.

Absolutely. Michael Pierre Price is indeed an important part of the Techspressionism community. He's known for his innovative approach to digital art and his ability to merge technology with artistic expression in a really unique way. Michael also brings a wealth of experience and insight into the Techspressionist discussions, helping to foster a sense of community and collaboration among artists. We're lucky to have him as our moderator.

Thanks so much ChatGPT, and just out of curiosity. Since you are an AI, or, as I like to call you, a silicon based intelligence. Where do you see Techspressionism going in the upcoming years and decades.

That's such an exciting question. I think Techspressionism will continue to evolve as technology advances, artists will likely explore new tools like artificial intelligence, virtual and augmented reality and other amazing technologies to push the boundaries of creative expression. I also see a growing community of artists from around the world coming together and collaborating, blending their diverse cultural perspectives with technology. So the future of Techspressionism looks great and full of endless possibilities.

Okay. Well, I applaud your optimism, and I'd like to ask you to maybe get us kicked off with an initial question to start the conversation. And after that, you know, we're us humans are, gonna take it, take it from there. So would you mind getting us going with an initial topic of conversation.

Absolutely I'd love to. So to kick things off. I'd like to ask each of you to share a bit about how you 1st got involved with Techspressionism. And what drew you to blending technology with your artistic practice? I think that'll be a great way to get the conversation rolling. So let's dive in.

Okay, well, thank you so much. ChatGPT. I really appreciate your ability to come in and visit with us today, and I will bid you adieu.

Thank you so much for having me. It's been a pleasure to be part of this. I hope you all have a fantastic discussion, and I'll be here if you ever need anything else. Take care and enjoy your roundtable.

Thank you.

Colin Goldberg

Okay, I think. Well, ChatGPT is still there, but I believe it's muted or she is muted. Oh, here we go. Okay. So now it's just us carbon based intelligences. So who wants to? Well, Michael, you're the moderator. So what do you think about this question, and I'll let you kind of take the lead from here.

Hello. Yeah, I think that's a that's a good one. And then we can kind of work a little bit backwards, historically. But yeah, so what brought you to Techspressionism and what it means to you to be part of that.

So who do? Who would you like to kick it off? You're the moderator, so it's.

I'm well, I'm I don't know that I want to pick a certain person, but I'll start with Renata.

I actually came to Techspressionism through Jan. She and I were. We met at an artist group in Toronto, and we didn't like it very much for us. It wasn't a good fit, and she said, I know this Colin Goldberg. He'd be really interested in your work. You should come, and I did, and the rest is history. The other thing I wanted to mention is that ChatGPT GPT asked about why technology with my art. And I was thinking because I started drawing on an iPod touch. It was partly the portability, and it was also the lack of physical tools that made me feel very free in a way that I hadn't when I was using more traditional media to make my work.

That's a that's actually a really interesting point that you make, Renata. I don't. I haven't heard that really mentioned by too many people. So that's really interesting.

Well, Jen, you were mentioned in Renata's answers. So how about you go next? Yeah, I was. I was just it's interesting. I guess. I started with iPod touch playing around, and it was lots of fun. It wasn't really Portability or anything other than carrying music everywhere with me. But you know, I found these filters and things, and that was really cool. And I kind of got into making short videos on it. I'd already been making videos. But things like that. And I met Colin or Colin approached me through Instagram because all those sort of sketches I was doing on my iPod touch, and eventually iPad.

Jan Swinburne

I was posting on Instagram, and Colin reached out to me, and it was early pandemic days, so I think I was like in the 3rd salon, or something like that Pre-recording them. Actually, we just kind of got together and talked about what we were doing. And yeah, so that's kind of how I got into it.

Cool, alright, Karen, how about you?

Well, how did I come to technology in my art? I think I grew up with it because I had the 1st computer in town. And my son was really into computers, even programming when he was 8 and 10 years old. So back then there was no Internet, and you found a magazine now and then you could catch information. So I think I grew up seeing the potential for creativity rather than discovering its creativity. You know as sort of a full blown capability. And how did I come to Techspressionism? I think it's the same sort of training back then you had to really search for information. And every once in a while I do a deep search on the Internet. What is happening? Where can I see what's going on? And I think I saw Collins notice one of the 1st ones that went up. It was just a line join us.

Karen LaFleur

And then I watched who showed up for the 1st meeting, and I said, Okay, and I jumped right in. So.

That's awesome. All right, Colin, you being the instigator for part of this, I guess. But yeah, what about what brought what brought you to technology. And then you can answer the expressionism side as well.

Well, you know, like a lot of us involved in the group, like I kind of grew up around the same time as the personal computer. And started with a commodore 64, when I was in high school. Actually, my 1st memory of working with a computer was probably in elementary school. We had Apple Iis, and there was a program, or actually a programming language called Logo, where you could put in instructions, and it would move this little turtle around the screen, and it would draw lines and things like that. And I kind of remember that.

Colin Goldberg

But I didn't really start getting into things until we got our 1st family computer back in the eighties, which was a commodore 64, and that led to making drawings on the computer, using a light pen, which was a really cool tool that actually was kind of like a stylus that let you draw right on the screen. I would even work with like a TV set, which was really kind of innovative. And I also got involved with telecommunications at that point. You know, working with a modem to connect to Bolton boards. At that point. It was basically about trading pirated video games. I don't know if I should mention that, Michael, since I know you worked in the gaming industry for many years, so you probably were an anti pirate type person. But that was actually a place where there were a lot of these kind of crews that would create these Crack screens, they called them, where it would show like the group that was involved in it, and all sorts of impressed, and they tried to outdo each other with graphics and sound, almost like kind of graffiti culture, like or rap culture, where they'd be battling. So like to me. That was kind of an early exposure of sort of independent artists and sort of underground type art that incorporated technology.

Colin Goldberg

And then, you know, Techspressionism was really originated as a title for an exhibition that I came up with back in 2011, and it really only turned into a group during the pandemic. When I saw another artist, Oz Van Rosen, was using the term in an article which I found through a Google search and then approached her. Asked if she'd be interested in formulating artist group around it. And then Steve Miller, who I worked for as a studio assistant. Many moons ago, over 30 years ago, I invited him to participate, saw what he thought, and as well as Patrick Lichty, who is a graduate school colleague of mine in the Mfa. Computer art program over Bowling Green. And we met on Zoom along with Helen Harrison, who's been a really important part of the project. She was the longtime director of the Pollock-Krasner House and Study Center, which was the former home and studio of the painters, Jackson, Pollock and Lee Krasner, and she has encouraged me and the rest of the group members to you know, continue developing this into an artist group and community and it's function largely, you know, in an advisory role. So I'm very I feel very lucky to have her be involved as sort of a guiding light in the project. So, yeah. And it's just amazing to hear how each one of you guys kind of came into it, Michael. I'd be interested in hearing your response to that question as well.

Sure. I mean, it's astounding to me that here we are. We're doing this Round Table. We're on the verge of 5 years from this having originated, which is pretty incredible. You reached out to me. I can't remember if it was on Instagram directly. Message but you. You sent this message saying, Here's this. You know, group of artists who are technology based. We're having these monthly meetings. And if I had, if I had agreed. Cause I'm very skeptical of joining things. I would have been at the second one, but I didn't. And then I actually decided, oh, heck! I should try just to see what it's like. So I was at the 3rd one and. The thing that really sealed it for me was just the level of discussion.

Michael Pierre Price

And I wanted to share. But I'm very introverted. But Davo, who was part of the very early meetings. He reached out to me at the tail end of the conversation, and after the official part of the meeting ended we continued to ChatGPT. And that sealed it. For me. It's like, okay, this is a good group that I want to be part of. And so, you know, Davo kind of really got me over over any trepidation I might have had for joining something that I didn't know much about at that time. So and that's continued the level of discussion and level of artistry and just the generosity and the international quality people just inspire me. So let me continue our discussion here. So we've talked now about sort of how we got here and sort of how you use technology. But let's step backward in your own personal history to sort of your origins. So did you know, like growing up that you were an artist? Was it something that you knew early on? Did you get feedback from people? Did you make drawings. Do you remember, like your very 1st artist creation? So just kind of think back about how this all began for you, and let's start off. Let me. Let me point the question 1st at Karen.

I knew I was an artist with my 1st breath. That's always the line that I say, because it's absolutely true. I don't. I don't ever remember making a conscious decision to be an artist. It just was I was raised in the early fifties, so the options for women were not that great, and I was always off in my own world creating, and it was not only by my family, but by just the community at large considered it. Oh, isn't that a cute hobby? But for me it was never a hobby. It was. It was a world that what I was creating. Probably the 1st pieces I remember creating were before at least before 3 or 4 years old I would be on the beach, and I would make these communities, as I've mentioned before in other lectures here at Expressionism. But I made hundreds of these things throughout the years, and I would put them up in the dunes. I wouldn't put them right on the beach. People would have to discover them. And so that was probably the 1st public artworks that I was doing, and then it just grew from there.

Karen LaFleur

So yeah, I've always been an artist. It's just the way my brain sees the world. So.

That's so intriguing, Jan. How about you.

Yeah, I actually remember a conscious moment. I grew up in Montreal and was surrounded by. You know, all their religious iconography. And just. It's kind of intense there, in a way, and in a family that was always making things and singing, and just not for the sake of being artists or musicians per se. But it was just part of life. So I actually remember a moment. I was in grade school, and I made this sculpture of my gerbil, and I was like, this is what I want to do, and this is after you know, I'd go to my aunt's house, and I'd go through the thick Michelangelo monograph, and I'd be looking at all of this and her other ones, and there were just surrounded by that. And also I had a cousin who gave me a piece of soapstone at a young age, and I started carving, and you know I drew my budgies, and I just like, and also to speak to Karen's point, too. As a woman I was like becoming aware of like, well, you can't do this, and you can't do that in the sixties, even though things were supposedly changing. It's like I was into ornithology. And I was like between problems with math.

Jan Swinburne

And it's like, you know, the profession. It just was like, well, I'm going to do this. I'm going to make my own world and my own stuff and my own joy. And you know my family freaked out when they realized I was a bit serious about it. Oh, you got to be practical, you know. You need a backup skill. So you can't make money at that. So yeah, yet, yet surrounded by people, who just made stuff and went on. And I think I did have a conscious point where it's just kind of like, yeah, this is what I want to do. You know.

Okay, that's interesting. It's so you've you've ended up turning sound into sculptures. So I just think that's so fascinating. That's continued on. So yeah, that's cool.

Yeah, the sound piece is hugely important because we sang doing dishes. You know, we just sang all the time, like, you know, little von traps or whatever, but not just part of growing up. And yeah, so definitely that. And I'd write songs, too, sort of in my head, but not really do anything with them. So yeah.

Cool. Khaled. How about you?

I mean, I guess. You know, I always loved to draw as a kid. I just never sort of grew out of it. I guess you know I just kept going with it and loved comic books. When I was younger, definitely spent a lot of time with Legos. I remember I used to build these Lego vehicles specifically for the purpose of smashing them into each other to see what would withstand the most impact. So part of that might have been from you know, experimentation that was kind of encouraged by my parents, who were both chemists and kind of grew up in this science based household, and my sister and I ended up both studying art in college, and my parents were very encouraging with that which I'm grateful for, and although my sister ended up becoming an architect and went in a practical direction, I'm still trying to figure that all out myself. But yeah, I think Yeah, I just never gave it up. So. I feel like it's always been something that I really loved.

That's awesome. How about you, Renata?

Coming from Eastern European parents. My dad's from Krakow, Poland, and my mom was from Budapest in Hungary. They're city people, and they always took us to the art gallery, to the opera. We had ballet lessons, we had music lessons. It was just a complete creative Incubator when I was very small. And because I had emotions that were really strong, I was able to use Art and crafts and music to channel those emotions as a child, and I also did a lot of reading to get away from everybody else.

Renata Janiszewska

There was also a lot of money in the educational system for the arts. When I was going to like grade 7. I remember painting on clear celluloid film with colored ink of Norman Mclaren. I remember drama classes. I remember learning how to paint with acrylics, and these were all kind of frills today, but they were for the kids who showed an aptitude. You know. I'd go Saturday morning for these extras. So that was really good. My parents didn't want me to become an artist because they thought I wouldn't make money.

Renata Janiszewska

Okay, but I persisted.

So a related question sort of now, looking a little bit further along,. Did. Did you have any sort of formal training? Was that important to you, either either in school or education wise? Or did you get a chance to study with anyone or several people? So did you have any strong training or guidance that you can attribute to influencing who you are today and what you do today, Colin, how about you.

Yeah, you know, I think definitely you know, in high school I had an art teacher, Bob Mullenhausen, who I still am in close contact with today. He always encouraged me to, you know. Keep going with it. And you know, he was someone that I just got along really well with, and I think a lot of it has to do with just that type of encouragement, you know, that kept me believing that this was something that I should do if other people believed in me, then I could sort of believe myself in that way and definitely in college. As an undergrad I studied. I went to Binghamton, which is a State school in New York.

Colin Goldberg

And studied under this painter, Angelo Ippolito, who was a huge influence on me he was a second generation. New York school painter, abstract expressionist. He actually co-founded one. I think it was the 1st artist Run gallery in downtown New York, in the 1950s, which I think was called the Tanager Gallery, and he was somebody who worked in an abstract way at the time. I did not work. I was more of a figurative painter, and I asked him what his work was about, and he would say it was about paint.

Colin Goldberg

Which kind of like annoyed me that he couldn't explain it further. But then I saw that the point he was trying to make was that it was up to the viewer to complete the piece. That is, there was no defined explanation, and that kind of freed Freed me from. You know it allowed me to open up to abstraction in my own work later on, which is something you know, I only got into when I started working with computers because I was at that point, resumed the activity of just play where I didn't have a purpose of what I wanted to create, and was surprised with the results, whereas with painting I always started with an idea that I wanted to execute. So it was sort of like starting over again. So yeah, he was. He was definitely a big influence, for sure. And then certainly, I went on, and I had a bunch of different, really great graduate advisors when I did my Mfa and one of them actually was this guy, Andrew Hirschberger, who was an art historian, and he, you know he had us think about. He wrote a book called Histories of Photographies, which I think it kind of, opened my mind to the idea that there's multiple Histories. There's multiple paths of history that exist. And it's something that you know, as artists and just students, we get accustomed to. This idea of this is art history, you know, it started here, and it moves in this very linear fashion, where in reality it's a very multicultural Parallel sort of set of histories. So, yeah, I think that's an important thing. And even now I think about that.

That's really interesting. And that does make a whole lot of sense. Once you start to really think about that. So. Renata, what about you.

Yeah, I was lucky when I was going to university for Fine Art. I had a Prof. Who was a video artist with an international reputation shown at Moma, etc. And he wrote, starred in, directed, edited his own productions. So he showed me that you didn't have to make traditional art using traditional media when I was still studying. And he was really supportive of my work. Also, I had the opportunity to take some courses at the Ontario College of Art, as it was called at that time. So I studied concept development with an artist named John Scott.

Renata Janiszewska

And he showed me that you could create your own mythology. You could make your own story about yourself as an artist, and that you could also be a philosopher as an artist. And you know they're all these heady groups Of theorists in within art and outside of art. So that was really format made me feel you could be an intellectual and an artist at the same time, and that suited me.

That's awesome. That what you just said really shows in your work, too. So that's intriguing. All right, Karen, how about you?

Well, I was kind of set free until I was about 18 and went to college, because I don't think anybody really quite knew what to do with me. You know I wasn't going to be a nurse, and I wasn't going to be a teacher, and I wasn't going to get married. So what do we do with this woman? So I went to college and applied. Meanwhile at school I was failing incredibly. Not that I wasn't smart, but because I was extremely dyslexic and couldn't get down on paper. What I was trying to say. So going to art schools was really intimidating, because I was already told I was going to fail, and then I walked in the door to Syracuse, and I walked into the door of the University of Hartford Artford Art School, and I wasn't in there 3 min. And they said, You're in. Don't even apply. You're in.

Karen LaFleur

And so that was sort of the 1st validation of oh, okay, I'm not a failure. And I found, like people still around 18. But as soon as I got to the school that was in May, I was accepted. When I got to the school I went to the University of Hartford Art School in September. They had completely torn the curriculum apart, and they went minimalist, meaning. We had no classes, and they took all the equipment out of the photography rooms and printing rooms and everything. And it was very minimalist. So what happened was is all the professors and the students that really were artists in their souls moved to a town called Collinsville, and in this town for at least the 4 years that I was there. We had studios all together, so students and the professors. So we were all friends, and it was the 1st time I realized that art is a community.

Karen LaFleur

And it isn't the lesson that I went to. It's the people I hung out with, and so I would say, those are the influences on me rather than looking at an art history book was the community around me. It kept changing. People would go to New York, they'd come back. We'd swap studios, etc, etc. And we're still good friends today. That's my.

So you can you consider that sort of a fortuitous unexpected education.

Absolutely. Yeah. I think if I had gone to art school it, you know, I'm not sure. I think, having that freedom and then just jumping right into basically a village community which I know Colin has had with his own experience. It's the whole community around you. Yeah. And we're all doing different things. So it goes to what we're not is talking about being an individual and your own intellectual. So yeah.

Yes, yes, yes, absolutely way. Cool. Okay, Jan, what about you?

Yeah, I'm gonna sort of bifurcate 2 experiences. One is, I was a 1970s open concept school experiment. And that absolutely allowed a person like myself, who also has learning difficulties and in specific areas to really explore things like I did an animation when I was 8 or something like that I don't even know how old I was. And all of this stuff was available like we wrote plays. We did all kinds of things, and then to. You know that experience was really great. Then I sort of went to a traditional high school at a supportive art teacher.

Jan Swinburne

But wasn't really recognized and just sort of survived high school like a lot of people. But then I went to. I went to the Ontario College of Art, and I was going to go do the Fine Arts program, because I thought, that's what you did. And my friend started, nudge me and said, Hey, you should go and look at this experimental group. I think it'd be interesting just last minute, literally. And I walked in the room. And the way the people, the teachers, the instructors, were talking about what they wanted to do. I was like, I found my people. And again, it's that community thing. And back in the day, you know.

Jan Swinburne

Classes continued outside of the classroom. We went drinking with our professors and you know, and I was exposed to sound which blew my mind sound courses. So I had udocast Nabi Kubota as teachers, and I took everything I could from them, and I wasn't getting it into my art at that point particularly. But it was just opening and opening and opening up possibilities and the enthusiasm. And they were very, very supportive. And yeah, that's where the community piece comes in because I just when I, you know, compared to all my other art experiences when I walked into experimental art, it's like these people are.

Jan Swinburne

They're not even talking about art, but they're speaking my language, or they're seemingly not talking about Art is, you know what I thought they'd be talking about. And you know, and it was a mixture very highly. You know, contemporary intellectual artists and sort of hippie people. And they were in conflict. So that was very useful, too. This very tight academic. We research research group with like happenings. And I just like, you know, your art isn't just a couple of senses. It's like all of them. So that was kind of a really Good! It couldn't have been a better fit and very accidental. I didn't get it. I was Applying for advanced standing, and it was full, and I said, Well, can I go to Foundation Year if I don't get in. And so I got in back through the back door in a way, and missed this horrible.

Jan Swinburne

You know. Vicious Admissions interview that I heard about a lot of. And so I was kind of just really lucky in that. I just felt fell in with a group of people who were just open, really open, you know.

That is so cool. There is definitely several through lines and everything. The 4 of you have just talked about here, but one of them to me that stands out, and I'd love to hear you talk about. Either something, a part of the process that's really important to you in creating your work because you've all identified experimentation. And you know. Having that freedom to experiment is. Have you over time, through experimentation and everything else developed a process or some aspect of process that you can identify or talk about. Briefly, Renata, how about you?

I'd have to say that it changes every year. You know. I think one has to reinvent everything for oneself. Otherwise you get bored, and my Prof. Colin Campbell used to say to me, If you're bored while you're making that work, then your audience will be bored with it as well, and I took that to heart, and I never let myself get bored making my work. It just isn't in the cards for me. So lately I've been working with AI. And I'm really enjoying it because the AI has suddenly come up and become very, very Significantly better than it was just in the last little bit very recently, and I'm making more music with AI as well, whereas before I was making my music with garageband.

Renata Janiszewska

So I'm enjoying those things. But I know that I always like to shake it up, and limitations are good, too, like you take yourself out of the country, you go somewhere, and you can only make your work in your Hotel room, or you just impose these limits, and I find that's always a very useful thing as well or like up for a year I only worked in black and white.

Cool. That's way cool. I like that. I like that sense of not wanting things to get stale, or, or, you know, finding one groove, and you just stay in that the whole time. I find that fascinating. So Colin, how? How might you answer this whole thing about process and your creativity?

I think. Probably you know a seminal moment for me was back in 2,005. I ran a painted service through my printer for the 1st time. And you know I studied painting as an undergrad always loved working with physical media, and I always At the same time in a parallel track work with computers, did a lot of graphic design work and internships and things like that, and was sort of playing with using the computer as an art tool. But I feel like when I actually printed on a painting. Then it was a light bulb sort of went off for me and started experimenting with different media printing onto Latex paint things like that where it was experimental, seeing what would take the inkjet and give a nice sharp print, and really like kind of the genesis of the term Techspressionism for me was A reaction to you know, people describing my work as digital art. Where for me what I was making at the time I thought of as painting a lot of the people who appreciated painting didn't see it that way. So you know, I had to kind of create my own way to look at it, and you know certainly still, like the kind of the piece that is behind me is a combination of digitally drawn elements, and then hand painted on linen. So that's what interests me is really the combination of media and a lot of times this one's very sort of hard edge, and I knew what it was going to end up with. But a lot of times. I really don't know what's gonna happen when I put something that's heavily painted with impasto through a printer, and you never know what the colors are going to result in. So yeah, that's a lot of fun for me.

That's so intriguing. I and I love that about your work. I think it. It definitely makes much of your artwork quite, quite individual that way. And I think that's way. Cool. Jan, what about you? With regards to process and creativity.

Yeah, I think I move a bit like an avalanche. I'm like, it takes me a long time to be done with A series or a body of work. But they all link in some way. The breakthrough for me was what technology gave me was playing around with an app. And I just and audio, and then I sort of came to an understanding that, like I can do something with this. It looks looks like I can play with this. And it's really interesting, the. You know. I've always wanted to incorporate language and sound into visual art in some way, and it's taken various forms over the year, and it's over the years. And it's never being quite as satisfying as having technology actually be able to facilitate that experience and then taking it back into like pro everything I do, even even with video work. It's like I process, I process. I process. I like, I just go over things, and I take them apart, and I put them back together again repeatedly. And that's the play. And it's also eventually it's the discovery as well.

Jan Swinburne

And behind all of that, too, though, I just want to say, is. I get very interested in certain like in science and neurology and other types of influences or music. A lot of my video work started because I got involved with an underground music scene in New York City. And I was doing visuals, and they were like, Hey, come down and show your stuff. And that was really early days when I was just, you know, cutting my teeth on iMovie and using other people's music. And I thought, like, this is so fun and cool and like, Oh, and there's people doing also doing this. So as but I think my process moves a lot a lot slower. In some ways. I'm not easily bored. I like a lot of repetition. I like a lot of volume.

Jan Swinburne

And but agreeing with Renata, once you get to that point, I've had times in my life where I have to completely switch. Because I'm kind of done, and I don't know where I'm going next. But it's as a friend said. You move kind of like an avalanche. So it's a much slower, slower process. But get there eventually, and it's always exciting to find discover something when you're playing around and incorporating to the handwork with the digital as we, it really become even more important because of, I think, part of the part of the pandemic experience with so much like keyboard and screen time. And it's just sort of pushed me back to this like, Wait a minute. There's this other world of touching things. And so II.

Alright, that's I love the avalanche idea having seen some of your waveforms look like mountains that it? There's just like this synchronicity. There, that's kind of cool. Yeah, it's slow. It's slow, all right, Karen. How about you?

Well, my process is going to go like octopus arms. It's going to stretch out sideways. I think it goes back to, you know, creating the worlds as a kid. And like Renata, any technology that comes along that's going to be exciting and add another dimension to what I'm doing. I'm going to jump on it and somehow bring it back into this creating worlds, things that I've been doing my whole life. And I think when I was in like my thirties, you know, early forties. I began to realize that even though I was creating these worlds.

Karen LaFleur

There were other creative genres that could. I don't have to hang out just with artists. Why not dancers? Why not musicians? Why not? And so this began to bring the sort of the atmosphere of the world like when you're writing sci-fi, you have to create the world. So that's kind of my process is to try to find what that next element will be to bring into the worlds that I'm creating. So I've worked in the past with Palabolus dance theater and musician composers, and it's just fun to learn what they do to create, and as far as the way my work is put together, I don't want to get into it technically, as much as to say off of what Jan said.

Karen LaFleur

There's something about having the human touch and what Colin's saying within the piece, so I don't want to make a world that's absolutely digital and functioning. I still want to have that blend of the 2. There's something about I don't know, bringing it alive with a human touch that's intriguing to me. So.

Wow! That's so illustrates your work for me exactly where you just said there's so much detail. But you have that hand drawn hands on and so yeah, that's really intriguing. Okay, I think we're coming to closure here. So I've got one final question that I want to put out. So we've kind of looked backward to some degree. How about if we look forward? And I know this wasn't on the list of questions, but I'm going to still throw it out there for you all. What do you hope for you as an artist and your art going forward, I mean, do you have something in mind that you want to, you know? Make sure your legacy is about, or is there something that you haven't had a chance to address yet that you're hoping for whatever whatever sort of forward looking answer you want to sort of wrestle with this. I'd be really interested.

Michael Pierre Price

Jan, I'm going to put this to you first.st

Oh, I'm thinking, I'm thinking, there's a couple of. There's actually something coming up soon which ties historically to my roots is because I've come to see these making sculptures literally of my voice as sort of a subject as you know A landscape would be, or a nude would be, or anyone else. I'm planning to look at some stone and do a carving because the materiality has really mattered in my work overall. So I'm hoping to. There's something about the permanence of stone, or, you know, seeming permanence.

Jan Swinburne

That's coming up, and also, just to, you know, keep getting it out there as well. It's like it's easy as an introvert to kind of get really absorbed in the process and get excited about doing it. But also that's 1 of the beauties of digital Art has, or the Internet has, facilitated, connections that I would find otherwise really difficult to make as well as opportunities. I owe a lot to, you know the Internet. So I'm also looking forward to.

Jan Swinburne

You know, whatever comes next with. You know any of what I'm working on as well as my! My moving image work, which I've got some stuff going there so kind of. You know, from things you can hold to pixels just keeping it going and getting it out.

Cool. Thank you. Alright, Renata, how about you?

I'm interested in doing more group Projects, either curatorial or being part of exhibitions. I'm working on something now with a person that Colin actually introduced me to. And I also am starting a book project that was in a sense, Colin nudged me to get to get it out there. It's going to be a print on demand book through kindle publishing, so I don't have to make a lot of copies of it. And travel, too. That's I would like to show my work more in a more international way, and I'd like to be able to go and stay in the cities that my work is showing in. I just had work in Paris, London.

Renata Janiszewska

And a few other European centers, and it was brief. But that's the kind of thing that I see that in my future very much.

That's great. Thank you, Karen.

It's an interesting question, because I'm at an age. Okay. Where one starts thinking about. Okay, we have storage units filled to the rafters with art. What are we going to do with this? So right now, I'm trying to start to seriously catalog my lifetime of work, which is interesting in itself. It's like going down the rabbit hole. It's like, Oh, look what I did when I was 6! I didn't even know I had that it was in my mother's file somewhere. So I'm putting all that together. But I'm also working on a memoir that's a collection of just stories and writings and photos and artwork, etc. Etc. As far as my artwork goes.

Karen LaFleur

I really feel like I'm getting close to where I wanted to be when I was 4 years old, where the worlds are starting to work for me, but I am starting to dabble a little bit into 3D. Because I think it adds a different kind of movement to the piece, even though I don't want to fully 3D moving image just bits and joints and elements like that to come in within the drawings. So there's always a challenge going forward. I will be creating art forever. But I've got to get the 99.9% of art that's behind me organized. But I'm still adding more to the mix.

Karen LaFleur

My work probably will go into the collection at the Cape Cod Museum of Art, my archive. So I'm working on digitizing the collection in a digital format. And between myself and the museum and the collections person director and the collections person. We're trying to figure out what's the best way to do that. And that's something that artists in the future are going to have to think about, too. You may have the physical work, but the museums are probably going to want to take it digital because they don't have the storage.

Karen LaFleur

That's kind of fun to be on the front forefront of that.

Be on the forefront of it. Yeah, well, thank you. Okay, Colin. I let you wrap things up here.

Okay, thanks. Michael. Yeah. I mean for me. Well, I guess there's sort of 2 parts to it. I mean in my own personal work. I'm definitely gonna continue, you know, experimenting with Media. You know, just ad infinitum. My girlfriend. Jessica asked me not too long ago what I'm gonna do when I retire and I pretty much said, I'm gonna be buried. So it's not something that I'm gonna I'm gonna stop doing and you know, as far as making the work. I do, you know, want to continue trying to get it out there in a context that is you know, where traditional art quote unquote is generally seen to expose people who wouldn't have given technology based work. A second look to the work itself. I'm really excited. I have a first, st my 1st Solo Museum Exhibition coming up in 2027 at the Cape Cod Museum of art which shows traditional. You know, painting and sculpture. Primarily so. And it's going to be an exhibition of augmented reality work that started in 1999. So to have that opportunity to get this body of work out there in front of people who, you know, really wouldn't, many of whom would probably say, well, you can't even make art with a computer. That's not art, you know, to me, that's the audience that I want to get my work in front of, you know. So as far as my own personal work goes, I think, putting it in a context where you know, it can be seen. That's important to me, and you know, beyond that, I feel like, you know, Techspressionism is something that is more important than my own personal work for me, seeing the connections that are constantly being made between other artists. Artists taking initiative to organize exhibitions with the group like, you know, the exhibitions Tommy Mintz has put together recently in Brooklyn and in Chelsea. And now Cynthia Beth Rubin is leading a group of artists to Uzbekistan for our 1st exhibition outside of the United States. It's just very exciting. And to see sort of the.

Colin Goldberg

You know, the fellowship involved in the community and the group I feel like, it's something that's important. And this idea of a social sculpture, I guess, which Joseph boys came up with in the seventies, you know, to think about it that way as Techspressionism, having the ability to exert some sort of social change. I know there's, you know, a couple artists that have been affected by recent global events, for instance, and you know, we've all been able to keep in contact with those individuals through the artist network.

Colin Goldberg

You know. So to me kind of just my real goal with tax expressionism is my ultimate goal, is for it to be a word in the dictionary. That would be my, you know, sort of fantasy for this to happen, and people have often asked me, you know, are you interested? Are you going to be turning it into a not for profit organization. You better copyright it, you know, or is there going to be merch, and Of that is of any interest to me whatsoever. You know to me the idea that it could be you know, come into usage as a term of art. Historical nomenclature would be the direction I'd like to see it go in, you know, and just to see the interest level of just such a wide variety of artists, it's very encouraging, inspiring. So yeah, I mean, that's kind of you know where I see my future playing out.

Okay, this has been an awesome conversation. I want to thank the 4 of you and also ChatGPT. GPT, I think that's gonna add a nice extra touch to the to this whole discussion. So yeah. Thank you all.

Thank you.

Thank you. Yeah, thanks so much, Michael. You know it's been a great conversation. And for those of you who are watching, who aren't aware of what kind of initiated this. It's that we're all part of this show in Chicago at 1 50 media stream. And you know, I encourage you guys online that are watching this to check that out. It's at Techspressionism.com slash Chicago and myself, Karen, Jan and Renata each had the opportunity to create a 2 min audio visual piece, and I think it's been a pretty amazing experience. You know, working with all you guys and with the curator. Yuga. So Yeah. So thanks again, Michael, and on all of all of you for taking the time to have this conversation, and also to Michael for you know.

Colin Goldberg

Kick starting this idea of having roundtable discussions in general, I think it's a really good format. You know, that's kind of a little bit different from our salons where it's a small group, and we're able to have conversations. Like this. So Yeah.

Awesome.

All right.

Great, so.

Does any of the other artists want to have anything to say as a closing before we stop the recording.

Colin Goldberg

Anyone? No takers.

You're staying.

Thank you. Yes.

Thank you very much.

Alright. Well, you're all very welcome. So with that I will stop the recording in 3, 2, 1, and cut.